Comments on The Pensive Quill: Killing Prison Staff

Mackers i actually respect the Black family for th...

2012-11-18T20:28:03.980Z

Mackers
i actually respect the Black family for their stance. Whether I like their associations or the fact the man himself saught no other personal self advancement than turning a key in a door, in spite of the horrors he saw at work, the family were consistent. I agree, who the fek would want McGuinness and co. there for a photo op?

Larry, I am not convinced there was any bigotry i...

2012-11-18T18:10:32.294Z

Larry,

I am not convinced there was any bigotry in the decision by the Black family in expressing a preference for McGuinness and SF not to attend the funeral. To me it looks like they felt it demeaning to have crocodile tears shed there in furtherance of a photo opportunity.

Robert,

While I know and like Trevor Ringland I thought his contribution on this issue was pretty lacking.

Ryan, is the outrage anymore faux than the outrag...

2012-11-17T17:41:00.604Z

Ryan,

is the outrage anymore faux than the outrage about capital punishment in the US?

Robert, Yes, some of what has been said is callou...

2012-11-17T16:54:33.757Z

Robert,

Yes, some of what has been said is callous. It is unfortunate but it is where we are at. That sentiment exists and does not sanitise itself to make an appearance here.

I don’t believe Larry is a political fanatic; the opposite in fact. I think he is pretty detached from politics and eschews ideology rather than embraces fanaticism. I feel that a lot of people who have come through prison do not see prison staff in a positive light.

While your point about the HET may be valid it does not explain how Sammy Tweed was charged with a prison escape. Nor is there any interest on the part of the state to deal with prison staff violence during the blanket years or police torture during the 1970s.

I always identified with Trimble’s tilt against fanaticism and those who seek political perfection. Where both he and Oz used the term fanatic I would use totalitarian. It is a mindset that I find abhorrent and frightening and one which is saturated with the culture of the bully. Larry, in my view, does much to challenge the totalitarian mindset here and at times seems to despair at the narrow-mindedness of the ideology associated with it. In some ways, when we set aside the bluster and winding up Larry reminds me of Mencken'c cynic - because he is cynical he is more humane than the idealist. Mencken preferred a government of cynics because he felt they would not try to perfect you like the government of idealists would.

Paddy O'Brien, a lot of thoughtful commentar...

2012-11-16T09:20:37.834Z

Paddy O'Brien,

a lot of thoughtful commentary in what you had to say.

we have a penal system that is out of control run by bigots and
Loyalists

Unfortunately, this is what it very much seems to be

Marty,

There is so much in what you say yet it goes ignored. Forget about the Justice Minister. He has become the mute voice of justice as far as prisons are concerned. The NIO, where power resides, know that the prison staff will abuse prisoners and have long covered for them as any prisoner from the blanket protest will vouch. I doubt very much David Black would have been killed had there been no prison issue although we can never be sure with people of the view that they can kill who they want and for whatever reason. There was a medical member of prison staff killed in 1989 when there was no serious trouble in the jail.

There is an issue in Maghaberry that is an open sore. Moreover, out of all institutional reform that came in post GFA the Prison Service has remained untouched. And with the British state pushing back the reforms made in other areas the signs don’t look good for the jails.

This was no fly by shooting. It was well planned ...

2012-11-12T21:38:25.648Z

This was no fly by shooting.

It was well planned and executed, they had to be watching Black for a while, and for a reason, they had to exact an escape route asap.

I have not lost any sleep over blacks death, No such thing as a good Orange Loyalist screw. They are bigots.
New I.R.A. claimed responsibility for it. another new group of republicans.

Retribution. No doubt it's only the beginnin...

2012-11-08T22:30:47.298Z

Retribution.

No doubt it's only the beginning.

OO/KKK in full swing then.

2012-11-08T18:31:42.641Z

OO/KKK in full swing then.

This appeared on facebook, posted by Rnu South Dow...

2012-11-08T18:27:03.277Z

This appeared on facebook, posted by Rnu South Down. It is deeply worrying and reinforces what many of us have been saying about the northern prison service for a long time.

Just been informed by Cógus Pow Tony Taylor that he is getting taken to an outside hospital after the prison medic finally came and seen him and confirmed he has broken bones in his hand and wrist.

Yesterday, Tony was attacked by an eight strong riot team who smashed his face of a prison van then held him down while the rest kicked him on the head and face. They twisted his already handcuffed hands up his back and at that point broke his wrist.

Tony informed the S/O just now that his hand and wrist is in agony as it has been confirmed as broken, he asked would he be forcibly stripped on the way to the hospital. he was informed that he would, despite his clear injuries.

Paddy; I agree with you about yer woman and her in...

2012-11-07T21:42:13.473Z

Paddy; I agree with you about yer woman and her interview. I've never seen anyone so nervous - and Carruthers went easy on her.

Can you imagine what she's saying to herself though? 'Sweet feck, what have I done coming to this god forsaken place!' Would be most likely her words.

Paddy 'The first one brought in, an Englishma...

2012-11-07T20:46:36.579Z

Paddy

'The first one brought in, an Englishman Rutherford, wanted to implement the recommended changes to the penal system in Maghaberry. His details were planted in Roe House prison cell by a prison warder.
Fact: Nonetheless, it had the desired effect, Rutherford, the reforming governor, was gone within days.'

so true...OO/KKK warders.

Robert

thanks for the clarification. Keep yer head down then lol

Awy back to Vatican tv RTE2
Celtic 1 Barcelona 0

Mackers I'm only kidding.. you know me. Aye i...

2012-11-07T20:43:10.245Z

Mackers

I'm only kidding.. you know me. Aye if we didn't have SF and michaelhenry my life for one would be a depression! Robert has had me laughing on here a fair bit. I'm sure he can 'roll' with the craic.

I'm hoping to do a PHD on how the British had a seriously good 'larf' both in Malaya and Norn-Iron!! Hope I can survive that comedy show.

Larry, 'Now whilst Robert refuses to address ...

2012-11-07T19:59:17.403Z

Larry,

'Now whilst Robert refuses to address the possible need for the historical crimes unit to address prison officer brutality....why don't we all get the hankies out and have a collective sob for OO member and life long screw mr Black. Then Robert the 'profiler' can feel a tad better. ALL TOGETHER NOW'

'The parable in the mouth of the fool is like the limb of a lame man'

It is highly unlikely that the HET will want to investigate assuaults in the jails for no other reason than it is essentially a 'cold case' murder unit.

In the last three or so years we have had three Go...

2012-11-07T19:09:33.036Z

In the last three or so years we have had three Governors in Maghaberry:
1) The first one brought in, an Englishman Rutherford, wanted to implement the recommended changes to the penal system in Maghaberry. His details were planted in Roe House prison cell by a prison warder.
Fact: Nonetheless, it had the desired effect, Rutherford, the reforming governor, was gone within days.
2) The next Governor lasted a year, despite the big salary. Opinion. Worn down by the bigots in the prison association.
3) An Englishwoman parachuted in to implement the restructuring of the POA.
Opinion: Looking at her interview last week I would doubt she will last the year.
Fact: the governors have openly admitted that it is the POA that runs the prison. All bodies such as, prison authorities, David Ford are merely stooges.
Sorry to pontificate, Irish physical force history is full of examples of "tipping points" be careful the prison issues does not become one.

Larry, don't take it so seriously. Dixie just...

2012-11-07T17:37:58.812Z

Larry,

don't take it so seriously. Dixie just took it up on how you sound rather than on how you are!! We fight, we forget, we all laugh at the SF Olympic gymnastic champions and life at the Quill goes on pretty much as normal.

Mackers... See what SF-ism and the piss process h...

2012-11-07T16:46:15.079Z

Mackers...

See what SF-ism and the piss process has done...you make a point or 3 now and you are 'on the attack!' ??? deary deary me.

Dixie, worry not about Larry going on the attack....

2012-11-07T15:44:28.532Z

Dixie,

worry not about Larry going on the attack. He takes it so he has to be allowed to give it out. We have never yet fallen out over it and can live with Big Boys' Rules!

Here's a wee article. The unionists can't ...

2012-11-07T15:06:31.154Z

Here's a wee article. The unionists can't stomach a truth forum/commission (whatever) NOT because republicans would be imune from prosecution, but may I suggest because they would be asked questions themselves and have to emerge from behind their 'victim' screen.

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/northern-irelands-past-will-keep-coming-back-to-bite-us-unless-we-agree-a-new-way-forward-16234437.html

Nial 100%. Now whilst Robert refuses to addres...

2012-11-07T14:49:27.350Z

Nial

100%.

Now whilst Robert refuses to address the possible need for the historical crimes unit to address prison officer brutality....why don't we all get the hankies out and have a collective sob for OO member and life long screw mr Black. Then Robert the 'profiler' can feel a tad better. ALL TOGETHER NOW!

Paddy O’Brien I couldn’t agree more – Ford is a t...

2012-11-07T14:13:33.706Z

Paddy O’Brien

I couldn’t agree more – Ford is a terrible failure in his post and his lack of action has allowed the prison issue to deteriorate to this level although he can’t be blamed on his own for the British who once again continue to portray it as an ‘internal issue’ have washed their hands of it and have simply been allowed to walk away from it and also let us not forget those who have experienced the discriminatory actions and quite often brutal actions of the British penal system i.e. McCartney et al for they must also share responsibility for their lack of action in trying to resolve this…simply using Kelly’s perspective of the prison issue, ‘he’s not one of us so why should we help him ’ is a terrible indictment of how low SF/MI5 has sunk…..irrespective of one’s ‘branch’ of Irish Republicanism – an Irish prisoner in a British prison should concern all.

Larry, 'Is that your PLANTER manifesto lmao&#...

2012-11-07T12:33:59.642Z

Larry,

'Is that your PLANTER manifesto lmao'

No Larry - it's your profile.

David, You have digressed somewhat from the point...

2012-11-07T12:24:42.103Z

David,

You have digressed somewhat from the point of argument. The issue I raised with Larry sought to deal with the callous nature of the discourse surrounding the killing of David Black. Moreover I flagged up the ability of ideology to suppress human nature. Accordingly your equating me with Trevor Ringland has no more relevance here than had you told me I play the piano like Barry Manalow.

'what i would ask you to accept is that groups of people you dont agree with may reserve the right to apply this framework to achieve what they would see as the defeat of the British state in Ireland.'

No. People generally reserve tables at restaurants or, for instance, seats at the theatre. No one can seriously be said to reserve the right to kill in the manner that you have presented it here. The vague employment of the term 'framework' is a euphemism for as we have seen the self vested 'right' to drive a car bomb into Omagh and other pointless sporadic killing. To what end? So that people might be free from that which they have democratically declared they do not wish to be free from.

Anthony had already addressed this central issue in the course of this piece as he has repeatedly done so after each killing. His argument is eminently strong - it fits the political and ethical terrain like a glove. Yours simply falls down the democratic plughole.

'I note even when trying to gain the high moral ground you cant resist the little veiled threat about "destroying"'

David- a quote that involves dwarfs battling with cranes should be taken with a pinch of salt!

The points you raise have already been addressed in Anthony's piece.

All applicants joining SF only have one question t...

2012-11-07T11:27:29.717Z

All applicants joining SF only have one question to answer..

WOULD YE SUCK A MONKEY'S DO-DA FOR ULSTER!

Belfast bookworm. Saw Maskey on tv last night. SF...

2012-11-07T08:43:34.330Z

Belfast bookworm.

Saw Maskey on tv last night. SF, seemingly without wanting to 'go there' or discuss the issue are determined to resist political status for the IRA of today. The very issue that put those British agents where they are today politically. Personally I recon if the campaign was ever to kick off properly an example of the top flight of SF would be the required first phase of the slaughter. THEN a ceasefire would be the 2nd and final phase.

Ryan

The media complicity in the nazi like piss-process is well evident that the OO connection to Mr Black and his long service to 'THE' community (Unionist community) during the worst of the troubles were covered over. A loving hero family man..etc etc..love to set his kids down and show them that movie about the blanket men getting battered by scum. But then again that's perhaps WHY he's their hero.

One thing I will say for the Black family biggots, they are sticking to their guns..no SF at that funeral. Am I the only one wondering did he call his kids Kyle and Kyra after Ian Kyle Paisley..?

Robert 'I immediately reall a definition prov...

2012-11-07T08:27:46.138Z

Robert

'I immediately reall a definition provided by Trimble based on the observations of Amos Oz,'A political fanatic is not someone who wants to perfect himself. No, he wants to perfect you. He wants to perfect you personally, to perfect you politically, to perfect you religiously, or racially, or geographically. He wants you to change your mind, your government, your borders. He may not be able to change your race, so he will eliminate you from the perfect equation in his mind by eliminating you from the earth.'

Is that your PLANTER manifesto lmao.